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levi501s wrote:

swan wrote:Weight. What an emotive issue.

My experience is that women are judged far harsher than men, by other women as well as men.

[No offense intended, Swan. Just using your post as a springboard.]

I agree with the quote and like to add that when it comes to success/confidence:

My experience is that men are judged far harsher than women, by other men as well as women.

It's been this way for eons. I really can't imagine why it surprises some people.

THus, it only stands to reason that younger women and older men are occasionally pairing off.

I do my best not to judge others as right or wrong, but rather to only judge if someone (something) is right or wrong for me.



just a thought

No offence taken. I agree with you Levi. My comment was purely about weight, I totally agree that men are judged far harsher than women for other things, certainly success/confidence and as you say combine the two and it certainly explains why these age groups pair off this way.

HannaSolo wrote:

My experience is that men are judged far harsher than women, by other men as well as women.

I agree with this statement. In my experience, if a particular man isn't interested in me because I'm too (old/young/fat/thin/whatever), it still doesn't move on to a "judgement" type thing. That specific man simply isn't horny for me, as an individual. Meanwhile, I notice (more on the interweb than in real life, granted), that men who are deemed undesirable are stigmatized WAY beyond the basic too old/young/fat/thin (plus short, for guys) thing. Their character and very "manliness" is poked at and mocked, by both women and men. It's quite mystifying, to me.

Because frankly, we live in a society where it is viewed as okay to pick on or bully a male that is not "good enough" to be accepted in the social norms.

It happens to overweight women too. The whole scapegoating or pecking order mentality is a product of years of fostering a closet authoritarian society.

It is the unwritten laws that more effect this country then the written ones. I think that fact is lost to those who live in a sheltered or privileged existance.

Now you're paraphrasing me.

No, I was agreeing with you..I had never said they didn't..

All YOU've been doing is 'presuming a superior position' and finding fault in others.

Nope..what I have been doing is expressing the opinion that I find some behavior unacceptable or unsocial..you aren't seriously claiming that no one has things they don't like in other people or behavior they find unacceptable are you? You have some pretty strong opinions about people's behavior in general , and individual's specifically, I don't see you holding back or being shy about it?

Then you're poor at articulating your thoughts.

Well, there's news flash...lol..believe I have admitted that on several occasions...

Don't put the onus on others to 'interpret' your 'meaning'.

I don't..but, to the best of my knowledge, no one but you has ever suggested they don't understand what I mean..if they did, I would try to make it clearer...like I did in that post...

Say WHAT you mean, and MEAN what you say.

So easy for someone left brain gifted to say...lol..While I get that most men, and some women, get frustrated that everyone can't quite think that way..I come by it honestly..I had nothing to do with the fact that I was born really right brained..I try, really, but it isn't easy...it's requires altering my whole natural brain process, that I have had all my life, and trying to think in a different , forced way..it would be like me asking you NOT to think so logically/rationally, concisely...could you do it easily? My intent isn't to be obtuse or difficult, and in my mind it seemed perfectly clear to me what I was saying...it is only after you called some of it into question that I saw I didn't say it quite clearly...I'm working on it and I believe I have gotten much better...but, to be honest, I like the way I think and I am not going to make myself totally over into what someone that different from who I am..

That's neither here nor there, in whether someone should censor their thoughts, because of who it might offend.

Show me where I ever said anyone had to censor their thoughts? I never tell anyone they HAVE to do anything...I gave the opinion that I didn't like that particular behavior ( and actually, unlike some people...I can not like someone's opinion, or thought process....and still like them...I'm kinda forgiving/understanding, see both sides, that way)...I didn't ask/require/or demand anyone had to change for me...I'm far too sure of my own flaws/failings and quite convinced I don't have that kind of influence or power to think anyone is going to do anything just because I would prefer it...did you feel some kind of compulsion or pressure to change your viewpoint? That would be the day...lol..

You've 'updated' your position,...

Nope..I clarified what I meant, even if I didn't write it in a way that was clear to you...

Now you're conflating MY discussion of "personal judgment" with YOUR "informed judgment".

Nope....I always meant informed judgment...if you are going to make a judgment at all...why not have as much information as you can so at least it is based reality not projection?

Basically, you're 'arguing'.
Whether you realize it, or not.....this is how arguments start.
When one person is talking about "A", and you go on talking about "B" as if it was "A", and trying to prove the flaws in their discussion over the topic of "A".
That's crazy making...

I don't know what to tell ya verity, I hate arguing really, the kind you are talking about...In my mind, I was talking about "A" all along...the way I handle this now in real life is to keep asking for clarification from the other party, because I just don't understand why they don't see the same thing I do...like they don't understand why I am seemingly on a different plane...it is unlikely that either party is going to change their mode of thinking, so, good communication, in my mind, would be to realize that all people don't think in the same way, and ask if it isn't clear, and understand that one way isn't better than the other...just different, and both are needed...something I actually first learned in marriage counseling...though it was too late for my ex and I...

if you actually don't know them..and being uninformed is sloppy and illogical...

Actually, I thought that whole last paragraph was one of my best attempts to stay logical and non emotional..it made brain sense to me, as opposed to emotional sense...

It doesn't take away from their 'feelings' (personal opinion) being valid and applicable to them.
And coming full circle.....that is why it's their 'right' to say what they want....

In the first place..again..I never said any such thing...I said I didn't like it and why...no different than what they did, or you are doing, I never said my opinion carried any more weight or "rightness" ( give me a break,..you know me...I'm so far from being convinced I know better than any one else it's laughable...lol), or that anyone had to do anything I said...nor, did I say they couldn't say whatever they want...I just said I don't agree with what or how they said it...how is that different from what you are saying to me? The charge of arrogance is so far off, I probably shouldn't even mention it....

All you've done, (in an extremely long and convoluted way....) is expressed you disdain for certain people, and how some peoples' comments are dissonant to you, and you want people to censor their thoughts, because of it...

All I've done, ( in typical "Zangie" way)is express my dismay at some people's rushing to judgments about people they don't know...which requires both generalizing ( which I know you hate) and assumptions...which I would think would be a bad thing for logical/rational/left brain people no? I never made a judgment on a person...just a behavior I find frustrating and mean, to be honest....like you comment on how much you dislike the way I post or think...and I don't believe in censorship..no one has to do anything for me, verity, I'm quite used to dealing with my own stuff, and not counting on anyone to be on my side or agree with me...but, my conscious/principles impels me to say something about behavior " I " find disagreeable ..I believe you are the same...so, I don't get what your complaint is...

EDIT TO ADD:

For those of you who hate long posts, and all the quoting, I apologize...just the easiest way for me to focus and do it when it is this situation...

zangie wrote:....something I actually first learned in marriage counseling...

Y'know...

A lot has snapped into focus for me.
Good luck, with all that drivel...

zangie wrote: All I've done, ( in typical "Zangie" way)is express my dismay at some people's rushing to judgments about people they don't know...

That’s not accurate at all.
You’ve attempted to do more than you claim.
You're backpedalling now....

Classic

zangie wrote: I never made a judgment on a person...

Noooooo….
Of course not.
You’re ‘zangie’, and everybody believes you're nothing but sweet.
You’d NEVER do that….
That’s what you’d like for everyone to believe…..unfortunately…

You’re not being accurate, or even honest..

When it comes to most people describing themselves, I don't believe anything I hear, and only half of what I see.
And it ALWAYS plays out well.

You're a hypocrite.

You must have a short term memory.
I just busted you on another thread, where you completely went to town on “judging’ someone, who you don’t even know personally, or ‘walked a mile in their shoes”.

Spare everyone the self-righteousness…

zangie wrote: my conscious/principles impels me to say something about behavior " I " find disagreeable ..I believe you are the same...so, I don't get what your complaint is...

You’re projecting.
I’m not complaining.
I’d have to give a sh1t, first.

I’m just questioning your comments, and wondering where your notions come from…
Now I have a better theory after learning you buy into 'marriage counselling'.

They're the worst promoters of perpetual fighting among couples, there is...

zangie wrote: I said I didn't like it and why...no different than what they did, or you are doing,

Ummmm……I’m not doing what you are doing.
I’d rather you stop comparing what you and I do….
You’re mistaken.

I’m not telling you or anybody else they don’t have the ‘right’ to express themselves.
I’m not telling anyone they should put more effort into being more palatable when expressing themselves.

Let's cut the bvllsh1t.
I don't buy into anyone's 'sweet' act, k?
People are as they DO, and not nearly as they often SAY.
I've found you being contradictory and hypocritical, and called you on it.

I’m actually promoting freedom of expression.
That’s something you are NOT.

I refer to the statement that I made some time ago.

Do you mean this one?

"Everything we hear is an opinion,not fact. Everything we see is a perspective,not the truth!!"

I like that, it's so true.

swan wrote:Do you mean this one?

"Everything we hear is an opinion,not fact. Everything we see is a perspective,not the truth!!"

I like that, it's so true.

I like the way that you read things in a positive manor.

Funny how money can balance out everything. It raises the desired height of men, it slims out thunder thighs of women, it makes people more attractive ... and it gives them the right to be rude. Money also give old men the ability to date much much younger women, and perhaps vice versa.

It can but so can having the same outlook on life. Same goals.

What is important and what is not will vary between people, generations, cultures etc.




A lot of this discussion seems to me to come down to this.

People generally find what they are looking for if they are realistic.

There is no getting away from the fact that as women age they loose status and men gain status. Men die younger.

it stands to reason that women finding themselves having to compete for men later in life have to learn how to do that, much in the same way that younger men have to learn to compete with other men to attract women.

A woman in her 40's has less time to learn before the pool of available men for a LTR drops off even more than it already will have done from when she was in her 20's.

If she isn't competitve in offering men of any age what they want she is going to get frustrated. Plenty of younger guys get frustrated too.

If women in their 40's + and men in their 40's + have widely different goals in life, more often than not you are not going to see 40 year old men with women of a similar age and a lot more single people.


Women 40 + complaining about there not being enough men available around their age range are right. They need to up their game if they can. The situation is only every going to get more competitive.

FunkyMonkee wrote:Women 40 + complaining about there not being enough men available around their age range are right. They need to up their game if they can. The situation is only every going to get more competitive.

Oh gawwwwd I best keep going to the gym then!

Women 40 + complaining about there not being enough men available around their age range are right. They need to up their game if they can. The situation is only every going to get more competitive

Nah,they just need to turn to TOYBOYS!