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In response to the OP:

In my 30s I had three serious relationships with divorced women that had dependent children. It was difficult and I don't intend to repeat it.

It can be taxing enough trying to get-to-know, build a relationship, with one person (her) let alone the added concerns. I found that when dating these women I was trying to build a relationship with her, her kids, and whether I wanted to or not, her ex. It can be overwhelming.

IMO, they are adding one person to their lives. I am adding 3-?.

I cautioned my brother (25 years married - divorced) about this when he began dating a woman with a child. After a 3 year committed relationship with her, they reached an impass regarding her child. She (GF) told him she wanted to take a break. Three months later she remarried her ex.

just a thought

I have had mixed experiences getting involved with women with kids. Two of my longest relationships involved being a father in house for someone elses kids. Raised them, nurtured them, mended their wounds, and helped put them through school or live day to day. Always ended badly, with the kids liking me more then her, which usually caused the beginning of the end. I have seen this be the result of other men who get involved with single mothers too. You are there for their amusement, not their love. That is just the reality.

Single mothers use a man as a whipping post, no matter how good he is to their kids. If you dont have the backbone to take that kind of grief, don't go there no matter how attractive, loving, or down to earth she seems. Normal relationships can be hard enough work. When you have one with a single mother, you are going to be second fiddle always, no matter what. Not worth the sacrifice to your life and sanity imho.

Personally I would never get involved with a woman with kids again. Befriend them maybe, but never a relationship beyond that. I would not recommend that any man EVER get involved with a woman with kids.

eyeofthecamera wrote:Always ended badly, with the kids liking me more then her, which usually caused the beginning of the end. I have seen this be the result of other men who get involved with single mothers too.

My experience as well, more-or-less.

Was always harder to say good'bye to the kids than Mom. Mom was an adult. The kids always ask why, "I'm sorry." wouldn't fix everything.

just a further thought

eyeofthecamera wrote:Single mothers use a man as a whipping post, no matter how good he is to their kids.

I call bullsh1t.

Period.

This statement stems from a victim-oriented mentality that I simply cannot get on board with, considering the over-generalized statement that it is.

eyeofthecamera wrote:I have had mixed experiences getting involved with women with kids. Two of my longest relationships involved being a father in house for someone elses kids. Raised them, nurtured them, mended their wounds, and helped put them through school or live day to day. Always ended badly, with the kids liking me more then her, which usually caused the beginning of the end. I have seen this be the result of other men who get involved with single mothers too. You are there for their amusement, not their love. That is just the reality.

Single mothers use a man as a whipping post, no matter how good he is to their kids. If you dont have the backbone to take that kind of grief, don't go there no matter how attractive, loving, or down to earth she seems. Normal relationships can be hard enough work. When you have one with a single mother, you are going to be second fiddle always, no matter what. Not worth the sacrifice to your life and sanity imho.

Personally I would never get involved with a woman with kids again. Befriend them maybe, but never a relationship beyond that. I would not recommend that any man EVER get involved with a woman with kids.

The problem I have with this statement is, you're generalizing somewhat, mind you ... you are speaking from the experience you had, and to some degree a lot of us guys and some gals have gone through it.

Second if anyone gets involved with a single parent with child(ren) and thinks that they will move up the totem pole so to speak or displace the children is dreaming in techno colour and needs their head candled.

Single moms using a man as a whipping post should be changed to some single moms and dads will use their partners as whipping posts, NOT ALL, the back bone part I didn't quite get, what does having a back bone to take that kind of grief supposed to mean?

I know a few single moms and dads who have great relationships, but most of these folks understands what it takes to sustain a relationship and knows how to balance the two , too many people whether you're a single parent or not jumps into relationships for the wrong reasons.

All I have to say is I now understand why guys would not involve themselves with me when my children were young.
The shoe is on my other foot and I see the light. Im even leery of the grand kid thing these days.
I've had a few screwed experiences in that department too.

you are going to be second fiddle always

Nope, your problem is thinking in a linear hierarchy when a Venn diagram better captures reality.

Speaks volumes though, the perils of "us vs them" thinking when a "we" works already, ....par.

This is just the same kinda' fæcked up "me-first" social conditioning that many men and women do, the destination is failure and loss, "always"
....to think you are competing with children is, ...well, ...a losers game.

Humphrey Osmond wrote:

you are going to be second fiddle always

Nope, your problem is thinking in a linear hierarchy when a Venn diagram better captures reality.

Speaks volumes though, the perils of "us vs them" thinking when a "we" works already, ....par.

This is just the same kinda' fæcked up "me-first" social conditioning that many men and women do, the destination is failure and loss, "always"
....to think you are competing with children is, ...well, ...a losers game.

I'm gonna disagree with you a little bit there Mr. Osmond.

In an optimum senario, the Mother and Father are a unified unit (is that redundant?). They are the examples and ultimate source of authority for the children.

When a second dad, or step-dad, comes into the senario, how much clout does he have? Ummm, in my experience very little.

Should he choose to stay in a situation where he has little to no say, then yes, by his choice he has become a victum, and/or loser.

That's why many men (including myself) choose not to put themselves in said situation.

Have no idea what a "Venn diagram" is, nor do I care to research it. Sorry.

I hope you understand my point. I think I do yours.

just a few more thoughts

levi501s wrote:

Humphrey Osmond wrote:

you are going to be second fiddle always

Nope, your problem is thinking in a linear hierarchy when a Venn diagram better captures reality.

Speaks volumes though, the perils of "us vs them" thinking when a "we" works already, ....par.

This is just the same kinda' fæcked up "me-first" social conditioning that many men and women do, the destination is failure and loss, "always"
....to think you are competing with children is, ...well, ...a losers game.

I'm gonna disagree with you a little bit there Mr. Osmond.

In an optimum senario, the Mother and Father are a unified unit (is that redundant?). They are the examples and ultimate source of authority for the children.

When a second dad, or step-dad, comes into the senario, how much clout does he have? Ummm, in my experience very little.

Should he choose to stay in a situation where he has little to no say, then yes, by his choice he has become a victum, and/or loser.

That's why many men (including myself) choose not to put themselves in said situation.

Have no idea what a "Venn diagram" is, nor do I care to research it. Sorry.

I hope you understand my point. I think I do yours.

just a few more thoughts

I second what Humphrey said, its dead on , ( not sure what the Venn Diagram is?) He will explain that to me one day lol, but the rest of it is Spot on
most people who fail in these types of relationship go in with the Me vs them, and/or trying to compete with the children( I know from my own experience I was one of them)
If you look at the successful relationship with step kids and step parents they have the " us " mentality and not the competing factor most of these relationships are known for.

levi501s wrote:Have no idea what a "Venn diagram" is, nor do I care to research it. Sorry.

Why apologize to me? ...not my loss.

levi501s wrote:I hope you understand my point.

Linear hierarchy, ...check. "Second dad"? WTF?
....curious, how many kids do you have?

levi501s wrote:I think I do yours.

No, I don't think so.

MahoganyRush wrote:(not sure what the Venn Diagram is?) He will explain that to me one day lol

It's a way of looking at things from a framework of inclusion as opposed to exclusion, intersecting geometries... instead of a "totem pole".